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Old 30-Apr-2011, 12:57   #1
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Problems with ADSL Line - Disconnects when phone rings

I thought I'd run it through with you guys first before submitting a support ticket with Xilo.

Previously I was with o2 and had a Netgear DG834 on their Home Access package and this problem I'm about to explain never happened when I was on that setup.

For the past 4 months I've been on ADSL2+/LLU with Xilo and have a Billion 7800N router. I have a Panasonic Dect phone (set of 4) in the household and being Dect the secondary units are all wirelessly connected to the main unit which is plugged into the main socket, that has an Adsl Nation xte-2005 master faceplate.

The problem is every time the phone rings, the ADSL connection disconnects not the wireless network itself. It reconnects no problem, but it is a hassle.

Now I'm guessing it's a line problem? and not wireless interference seeing as the network stays live.

Here are my line stats:

SNR Margin(Upstream) 60
SNR Margin(Downstream) 92
Line Attenuation(Upstream) 245
Line Attenuation(Downstream) 420

Is that bad or good? and if it's bad... I'm presuming I'll have to approach Xilo about this? or am I stuck with a shoddy line connection? Oh and I've tried changing wireless channels, 1,5 and 11, but that hasn't made a single bit of difference.

Last edited by burundi; 30-Apr-2011 at 13:19. Reason: Does require it's own thread.
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Old 30-Apr-2011, 13:21   #2
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I've moved it to it's own thread Blurr - i think it does require it.

Sounds like a BT issue, I would log it with your ISP who should log it with BT for you.

Stick your phones into the test socket bypassing the faceplate totally to rule out issues with the faceplate, but if in doubt your ISP's tech support should go through this anyway.
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Old 30-Apr-2011, 16:13   #3
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Cheers, just put in a ticket and got a response...

Quote:
The old ISP will have been a 448k upload and it is possible your line cannot support the higher 1Mb rate.

I will request this be capped to 512k which should hopefully resolve the issue for you.
Bah, the 1mb upload was handy when uploading photos. Oh well, will see how it goes !
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Old 30-Apr-2011, 16:55   #4
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I take it that the line attenuation is 42 rather than 420? 420 would imply that your are connected to your local exchange via a phone line wrapped around planet earth lol.

My old connection attenuation was 44 and I was synced at 7,800 kbps to the exchange. First thing to check for a disconnection when the phone rings is the filters, they split the ADSL signal from the incoming phone calls and so if a filter is playing up then it can get cut off. Also try unplugging the phones in the house but leave the ADSL connected then phone the house number from a mobile or another house phone off the property and see if you still get disconnected. Should still discon you if the filters are fucked but if not then could be somehting dodgy with the phone itself.

Also your SNR downstream margin says 92? I'm guessing that's supposed to be 9, the default for a stable line is 6 and it will creep up in increments of 3 if the exchange thinks the line is becoming unstable, this lowers your speed. Because you have been getting disconnects when the phone rings the exchange has probably started raising your SNR to try and stable the line, IF it is the filters playing up then raising the SNR will NOT fix it and the SNR will end up through the roof and really fucking over your possible sync speeds.

Like I say try the filters first. It could still be a line fault as ADSL2+ is a lot more twitchy with longer lines. Also do a quiet line test by dialling 17070, preferably from a corded handset to make sure there is no external interference. The line should be very quiet.
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Old 30-Apr-2011, 17:14   #5
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Cheers for those suggestions Rainy. Yeah the numbers appear to be missing a decimal point !

Did the quiet line test and it was dead silent.

Unplugged the phones and rang the number, didn't disconnect. However, when the phones are plugged in, I dialed the home number again, picked up and it disconnected straight away.

So it would appear the connection disconnects only when the phone call is answered and the call is connected. Would that suggest a filter problem?

Last edited by blurr; 30-Apr-2011 at 17:18.
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Old 30-Apr-2011, 17:26   #6
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worth swapping the filters out for new ones. Better to spend a few quid on filters as a test rather than have the ISP gimp the upload speed. I'm surprised the ISP's first response to a line disconnecting when an incoming call is made wasn't to check the filters. It's basic ADSL fault finding.

Hopefully it will fix it mate, What sort of speed do you get on your downloads? I would think with a attenuation of 42 "should" get you around 8000 to 9000 kbps.
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Old 30-Apr-2011, 17:29   #7
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I sync at 5600-6000 downstream, around 1000 upstream. Download at around 570kb/sec

I thought ADSL Nation was a decent make... any other recommendations for a master plate? I have had this for 5+ years, might have been knocked quite bit when doing the vacuuming as it is on ground level.

Hmm odd thing is when making outgoing calls from the home phone, the line doesn't disconnect at all.

Last edited by blurr; 30-Apr-2011 at 17:50.
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Old 30-Apr-2011, 20:29   #8
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Blurr, Out of interest the router doesn't do VOIP too does it? It might be detecting the incoming ring itself?

My Billion 7402NX did crazy stuff like that.
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Old 30-Apr-2011, 23:48   #9
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Nope, no VoIP on the 7800N.
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Old 01-May-2011, 08:50   #10
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ADSL Nation were always a good make for master plates. It's possible that the plate itself has deteriorated over time and now just started failing, although that is a lot less likely. If you got the spare bucks to buy a new plate just for testing then I would say that's the best first step because it sounds like your ISP are not willing to do any fault finding and just want to lower the speed.
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Old 01-May-2011, 08:54   #11
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http://community.bt.com/t5/BB-Speed-...LP/td-p/167441

just found that on the BT ADSL forums, seems some people on ADSL2 are suffering from the same problem as you. Only problem is that BT them selves don't seem to be able to figure out why. Hopefully you're not one of the those stuck with a BT mess. If it is only the faceplate a swap out should sort it.
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Old 05-May-2011, 01:19   #12
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pray that its the filters, modem or socket or you'll be in diagnosis hell i'm afraid.
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Old 05-May-2011, 10:13   #13
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Any news on this Blurr?
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Old 05-May-2011, 10:59   #14
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A small update, Xilo capped my upload, it now syncs at 512 instead of 1002. However, my SNR upstream noise has increased from 6.0 up to 19.0. Getting disconnected every 30 minutes or so during the evenings/peak time, whether or not the phone rings.

I've informed Xilo of this so will just have to play the waiting game.
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Old 05-May-2011, 13:36   #15
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You didn't try the filters first?
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Old 05-May-2011, 14:19   #16
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I replaced the face plate with the original BT one and plugged in a filter that came with the router and the problem still occurs
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Old 05-May-2011, 14:34   #17
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Ahh OK. Next thing might be to borrow or steal a router for the night just to eliminate that from the faults. Does not sound like a router issue but you never know.

It sounds like your ISP's tech department are script readers. They really shouldn't just do a cap on a line without at least doing the basic fault finding first.
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Old 05-May-2011, 17:32   #18
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Are you on LLU with Xilo? because if you are then I'd suspect that C&W have a dodgy filter on their line card and you want a lift and shift

on the basis that the line worked previously
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Old 05-May-2011, 21:26   #19
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I've got the exact same problem, I've had no luck fixing this and i've replaced the routers/filters and fucked about with the test socket. It's bloody annnoying.
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Old 05-May-2011, 22:42   #20
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Leady, I am with LLU on Xilo, to get "unlimited/unmetered" broadband, that was my only viable route. Previously I wasn't on LLU and just regular ADSL with o2.

I got a reply from Xilo and they're looking further into the problem, and to my surprise, even referenced this thread !
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Old 06-May-2011, 09:07   #21
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Blurr or Envy could you look at your router logs and try and find an entry around the time of a disconnection. It's possible that the line is not dropping to the exchange but the link to the ISP is. Usually if the line drops completely it would say something along the lines of:

LCP DOWN
LCP IS ALLOWED TO COME BACK UP

If that's mentioned in the logs then the line is losing its connection to the exchange. If it says something like PPOA LINK DOWN then it's just the connection to the ISP dropping.
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Old 06-May-2011, 10:31   #22
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Hello Xilo techies ... Fix our Blurr's problems now!!!!111
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Old 06-May-2011, 11:32   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilb View Post
Hello Xilo techies ... Fix our Blurr's problems now!!!!111
I think a psychiatrist is more appropriate for Blurr's problems, however the ISP techs might indeed fix the phone line
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Old 06-May-2011, 12:02   #24
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hahaha excellent !!
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Old 10-May-2011, 00:29   #25
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Ahh here's the log as you requested Rainy

Quote:
May 09 23:25:14 user syslog: web: logout (timeout)
May 09 23:25:14 user syslog: web: 192.168.1.103 login
May 09 23:25:51 daemon pppd[479]: No response to 6 echo-requests
May 09 23:25:51 daemon pppd[479]: Serial link appears to be disconnected.
May 09 23:25:51 daemon pppd[479]: Clear IP addresses. Connection DOWN.
May 09 23:25:51 daemon pppd[479]: Clear IP addresses.
May 09 23:25:51 user syslog: begin: interface: ppp_0_0_38_1 go to down
May 09 23:25:51 user syslog: end: interface: ppp_0_0_38_1 go to down
May 09 23:25:57 daemon pppd[479]: Connection terminated.
May 09 23:25:57 daemon pppd[479]: Connect time 71.5 minutes.
May 09 23:25:57 daemon pppd[479]: Sent 5376749 bytes, received 106030953 bytes.
May 09 23:25:57 user kernel: dev_shutdown, dec ppp device refcnt, dev->refcnt=3
May 09 23:25:58 user kernel: unregister_netdevice: waiting for ppp_0_0_38_1 to become free. Usage count = -1
May 09 23:25:58 user kernel: dev->name = ppp_0_0_38_1, dev->refcnt=-1
May 09 23:25:58 user kernel: after reset to 0, dev->refcnt=0
May 09 23:26:00 user syslog: ping -c 1 168.95.1.1 &
May 09 23:26:01 daemon pppd[479]: PPP: Start to connect ...
May 09 23:26:02 daemon pppd[479]: Using interface ppp0_0_38_1
May 09 23:26:02 daemon pppd[479]: Connect: ppp_0_0_38_1 <-->
May 09 23:26:11 daemon pppd[479]: LCP: timeout sending Config-Requests
May 09 23:26:11 daemon pppd[479]: Connection terminated.
May 09 23:26:14 daemon pppd[479]: PPP: Start to connect ...
May 09 23:26:16 daemon pppd[479]: Using interface ppp0_0_38_1
May 09 23:26:16 daemon pppd[479]: Connect: ppp_0_0_38_1 <-->
May 09 23:26:25 daemon pppd[479]: LCP: timeout sending Config-Requests
May 09 23:26:25 daemon pppd[479]: Connection terminated.
May 09 23:26:28 daemon pppd[479]: PPP: Start to connect ...
May 09 23:26:29 daemon pppd[479]: Using interface ppp0_0_38_1
May 09 23:26:29 daemon pppd[479]: Connect: ppp_0_0_38_1 <-->
May 09 23:26:38 daemon pppd[479]: LCP: timeout sending Config-Requests
May 09 23:26:38 daemon pppd[479]: Connection terminated.
May 09 23:26:42 daemon pppd[479]: PPP: Start to connect ...
May 09 23:26:43 daemon pppd[479]: Using interface ppp0_0_38_1
May 09 23:26:43 daemon pppd[479]: Connect: ppp_0_0_38_1 <-->
It keeps trying to reconnect, and the only way it does is if I turn it on and off at the router. Before it would just reconnect automatically if the connection dropped.

Xilo have been incredibly helpful so far, so fingers crossed that it can be sorted out...
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Old 10-May-2011, 07:07   #26
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Daft question, but have you tried swapping to different 'phones to see if that resolves the problem ?
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Old 10-May-2011, 10:13   #27
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Aye it looks like the line it's self is dropping Although it seems strange that you would have to reboot the router to get a connection again. It seems as though the router is also struggling, this could just be the amount of errors the router is trying to correct before the line drops or it could be an indication that the router is also a problem.

Really is worth trying another router if you can borrow one, also like Kahuna said try different phones.
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Old 10-May-2011, 11:07   #28
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I've known cheap DECT phones to cause disconnects.
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Old 10-May-2011, 11:10   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rainy View Post
Aye it looks like the line it's self is dropping Although it seems strange that you would have to reboot the router to get a connection again. It seems as though the router is also struggling, this could just be the amount of errors the router is trying to correct before the line drops or it could be an indication that the router is also a problem.

Really is worth trying another router if you can borrow one, also like Kahuna said try different phones.
Stranger things have happened. This morning I had to restart a connection that drops on occasion. The only way (short of rebooting the router on site) is by ringing the line from a telephone or running a line test from MOPS (our provisioning platform). Rang the number and let it ring about a dozen times, waited 2 minutes and the ADSL was back up!
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Old 10-May-2011, 12:01   #30
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I would try my old Netgear DG834, but it's the very early version and has no support for ADSL2+. I'm quite confident it's not a router problem though, as I've only had it since Christmas and it seems to be moving from one problem to another now since having capped my upload. While it doesn't disconnect when the phone rings, it disconnects at a certain point late at night, sometime after 10pm and the connection only stays live for around 30 minutes or so. During the day it's fine now even when the phone rings.

As for the phones themselves, they're Panasonic, and weren't exactly cheap No other phones to try, but I could just disconnect it late at night and see what happens.

Xilo are going to be running some tests tonight so hopefully something will get picked up from that.

Again, thanks for all the help and suggestions, mucho appreciated !
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