Congrats to Lance Armstrong - legend.

[tinx]

Winner of Le Tour De France, for the 7th time in a row. A personal hero of mine, well done to the fella!

[D.Celt]

Good work fella, should be in the cycling hall of fame for that achievement.

[[n00b].eesh.]

Awesome.

[Lungboy]

Aaaand about to be stripped of all 7 titles.

[jimbobaggies]

Bit of a farce really. 7 years to decide they have the evidence to prove that he was a drugs cheat... let's see the evidence, non of this it will be made public "at the right time" bollocks. They either have the evidence or they don't.

Anyway, cue the sysagent bandwagon...

[jimbobaggies]

Coincidentally, I believe he has never been tested positive, so what actual evidence could they have?

Also, the USADA is a US body, surely it is only the UCI that could strip him of his titles?

Like I said USADA need to make the evidence public, and allow and the UCI to make a judgement.

EDIT:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/...dfbf26d4ec868e

"On Friday, the International Cycling Union said not so fast. The UCI, which had backed Armstrong's legal challenge to USADA's authority, cited the same World Anti-Doping Code in saying that it wanted the USADA to explain why Armstrong should lose his titles. The UCI said the code requires this in cases "where no hearing occurs."

Armstrong clearly knew his legacy would be blemished by his decision. He said he has grown tired of defending himself in a seemingly never-ending fight against charges that he doped while piling up more Tour victories than anyone ever. He has consistently pointed to the hundreds of drug tests that he passed as proof of his innocence during his extraordinary run of Tour titles from 1999 to 2005.
"There comes a point in every man's life when he has to say, 'Enough is enough.' For me, that time is now," Armstrong said Thursday night, hours before the deadline to enter arbitration. He called the USADA investigation an "unconstitutional witch hunt."

[[n00b]Zippy]

It seems really strange this, surely positive test = cheat, no positive test = not a proven cheat. End of.

[Lungboy]

As Judge Judy would say though, no innocent man would admit to something they didn't do, and by not fighting this, it's a tacit admission of guilt.

[jimbobaggies]

If he is guilty he is guilty, I just don't like how a US agency feels they can state it will strip him of his seven Tour de France titles. Surly that is up to the governing body of the sport, and they will only do that based on hard evidence, something which USADA has not presented as yet.

[Lungboy]

It sounds from some reports that there was some evidence of wrong doing, and that by defending himself, it would have all come out in court. By not defending himself, he admits guilt and none of it gets released to the public.

[Scrobbs]

Wasn't this the guy that was supposed to be dying of cancer as well?

[jimbobaggies]

Originally Posted by Lungboy

It sounds from some reports that there was some evidence of wrong doing, and that by defending himself, it would have all come out in court. By not defending himself, he admits guilt and none of it gets released to the public.

But that goes back to;

Originally Posted by jimbobaggies

The UCI, which had backed Armstrong's legal challenge to USADA's authority, cited the same World Anti-Doping Code in saying that it wanted the USADA to explain why Armstrong should lose his titles. The UCI said the code requires this in cases "where no hearing occurs."

[Sh0cked]

I want to see the evidence. I think Lance is a legend and until the evidence is provided and a hearing held my opinion on the man won't change.

Agree with Jimbo though all smells a bit off from the USADA

[Scrobbs]

The WADA are claiming they have witnesses etc.

[Sh0cked]

Witnesses predominantly have something to gain they are subject to influence in my eyes, I want some in-disputable test result based evidence.

[Inertiaman]

There's plenty of that, unfortunately for the USADA it lets Armstrong off the hook.

[Lungboy]

Then why isn't he fighting it?

[Sh0cked]

I don't know, perhaps he has mentally reached a point where he no longer has the will to fight it.

Being British you should know all about that, we long ago lost the will for a fight hence the massive amount of taxation on Fuel, Booze, Cigs, Income, etc etc etc...

(note the above is not a discussion topic lets keep this to Lance.. )

[Inertiaman]

Putting aside the did he/didn't he - because they have absolutely no power to remove his titles and achievements? Continuing to attend their endless hearings and respond to their requests is an utter waste of time to anyone who will never ride at an international level again.

[Lungboy]

I'm rather confused then, if the ADA have no authority to do anything then why all the posturing?

[Inertiaman]

Because that's their job - the trouble is in this case that they failed to make a case at the time, have failed to make a case since and continue to claim justification based on evidence that they won't release. If this were aimed at a lesser value scalp it would have been binned five years ago.

[Inertiaman]

Bear in mind also that they have no recourse to punish in a guilty verdict - all they can do is refer findings to the sporting body concerned. In this case the body is the UCI and they're backing Armstrongs appeal.

[jimbobaggies]

Originally Posted by Lungboy

I'm rather confused then, if the ADA have no authority to do anything then why all the posturing?

Apparantly they do;

Fahey also said that any sanction imposed by USADA must be adhered to internationally as stated in the WADA code.

He added: "I am confident and WADA is confident that the USADA acted within the WADA code, and that a court in Texas also decided not to interfere.

"They now have the right to apply a penalty that will be recognized by all WADA code countries around the world."

USADA, meanwhile, have stated that their evidence against Lance Armstrong will be made public in due time.

USADA also accused five of Armstrong's associates including Johan Bruyneel, the sporting director who guided the American to his Tour triumphs, with cases against them still ongoing.

When asked if he expected details of the allegations against Armstrong to emerge, USADA chief executive Travis Tygart told Velonation: "Yes, absolutely - at the right time.

"Obviously there are other cases that are alleged to be involved in the conspiracy. Their cases are still proceeding, so it will be in due course."

SO it sounds like they are saying that the evidence would affect other cases that are currently proceeding... then surely they should wait until such time that they can release any evidence before they start spouting?

[Inertiaman]

Of course the WADA will back the USADA. But that doesn't seem to have got them any closer to a successful verdict and has offered no influence on the UCI's stance - regardless of how many people they have lined up to testify.

Again - you have to look at the process in isolation and forget personal opinions on Armstrongs cheating or otherwise. The fact remains they've fluffed the process over and over again and need to stop spending taxpayers money on hunting their own personal moby dick.

[mr_o]

Originally Posted by Lungboy

I'm rather confused then, if the ADA have no authority to do anything then why all the posturing?

What's this got to do with Dodgeball??


On topic they need to just give up. If he was doping he has got away with it for so long to be honest I doff my cap. Because he was clearly smart enough to do it if that's the case.

[Dingle]

So basically everyone was taking drugs and he was the fastest of all of them taking drugs, so surely he keeps his titles anyway?

[Lungboy]

So although WADA will recognise the USADAs sanctions, and all WADA countries will have to recognise it, the UCI won't as it doesn't have to obey WADA?

[Inertiaman]

yeah - basically if the USADA successfully reach a negative verdict, Lance Armstrong won't be able to compete in the Tour de France or <other international tour that Lance isn't entering anyway) again.

Can you see why he doesn't give a shit?

[Inertiaman]

The big issue and the main reason to fight the issue as I've read it is that he'd get his previous accolades stripped. If that outcome is called out as unattainable by the USADA then why bother arguing the toss?

[Lungboy]

Do WADA have no leverage with/against the UCI then? I don't really know how it works, but could WADA stop France hosting the Tour for example?